Tuesday, November 13, 2012

Gay Rights to Rites - HAD a GUT FULL of them!

B'H
Just picked up my mail in the post office today and had a chat with my postmistress. We often have a little chat. One of the benefits of country living is that you can form close chatty relationships with people like the Post mistress, the school teachers that teach your child, the garbage truck collector and the local shire people that you normally would not even give the time of day in the city because you are too busy rushing here and there. The country pace of life is slower and more civilised.
These are the normal every day simple folk who go about their business and are salt of the earth, commonsense individuals. We talked about the push for these same sex marriages and the Hu Ha about gay peoples' rights to rites and frankly both of us found it disturbing. As she said, we can't get away from them and just have a normal TV experience, we have to have gay people in soaps, gay newsreaders, gay radio shows, gay politicians (quite frankly they are the worst), gay bars,gay events, gay movie stars and the rest.
I used to go to the movies, but don't any more or if I do, I can only watch the kid shows or G rated stuff. Some of the PGs are now too adult for me and mine. Do I want to go to the movies and be confronted with two women pawing each other's naked bodies on the big screen? NO. Do I find the sight of two men simulating G-D only knows what on a big screen? NO, NO. Do I want to view a man and a woman being intimate in a way that they should be behind a locked door at home in private on a big screen in front of me?  NO, definitely NOT.
We have become such a vulgar society. What is worst is that it is seen by younger under thirties and even the forty and fifty somethings as 'normal'. Don't ask about the younger teens and twenties group. It is all they have ever known and having video games with androgynous females being battered and thrown about, is entertainment. That is the scary part that nice society and manners has all gone out the window. We are all about the rights of this and that person or group, that we really do not know who we are or what we are.

Look at the Prime Minister Julia Gillard. Yes, she is a woman. Is she an appropriate role model for young women? Think again. She has been cohabitating with her  current partner for and does not marry him despite holding the highest government office position in the country. Is that what one wants for a daughter? Not at all. But these are modern times. They also had 'modern times' in ancient Rome and also in Egypt. She has also had some very questionable dealings involving finance and while Slater and Gordon are good at covering up what happened to these funds, there is only so long you can keep the lid on a simmering pot and one day it will boil over with the help of one of her political rivals. Julia needs to watch her back.
Then, we have our dear Craig Thompson. How a person like that gets into Parliament and we pay for a greasy pig like that to represent an electorate who knows?  This country is really going to the dingoes and the rabbits.
With John Howard there was not a whiff of a scandal and the guy led a boring life, but he did the job he was paid to do. Not so these ALP coots. The go to see a bit of lap dancing, fiddle with funds that they should not have their dirty little fingers on, visit a massage parlour or two and have a little bit of R and R at the expense of the tax payer or the Union members and we say and do nothing. It is beyond a joke.
Then they want in NSW to educate kids that being gay is 'normal'. Where is it going to end?
I say let's start a Radio Station for Rednecks and get Andrew Bolt and Alan Jones to hit the airways. Let's call it Radio Rednecks United with Bogan Conservatives. We could have talk shows for the norm of society and we will not discriminate against gays.
 We will put them on for an hour a day at midnight (past the family hours) with Alan Jones, Tony Abbot and Fred Nile if he is still alive, or maybe we could call him back from the other side, and let them present their case for equality despite being a minuscule cult part of the population. This gay cult thing needs to be stopped in its tracks before they destroy the minds and intellect of our young and vulnerable.

84 comments:

thatsmyphilosophy said...

You remind me of the white Americans in the 60s who complained about all these black people popping up on the television. And black people kissing each other? "Ewwww, we don't want to see that, and we certainly don't want our innocent children exposed to it!" How very silly and prejudiced those people seem now, eh?

Chrys Stevenson

Margaret said...

This is Poe's Law in action, right?

Simon666 said...

Leeds, goodness me, we need to find a new planet for you. Or perhaps a neat little apartment in Tehran.

Kyle Green said...

I honestly can't understand how people can still have views like this. So a man and a man or a woman and another woman love each other? They are both consenting adults and if they are with someone they love how does it cause any problems? Just because you don't like to see something does not mean it shouldn't be allowed.

mrbrennan said...

Why not just let gay people get married (it won't affect your life at all) and then forget about it and move on?

ManKitten said...

Leeds, deal with it. Just because some people don't fit into your neat little box of who is or isn't acceptable doesn't make you right. It only means you have an opinion - a narrow-minded, bigoted and childish opinion at that. I was born and raised in the country and I didn't turn out this socially backward so I can only assume you're too scared to face the fact that things change.

Tom said...

I think the best question to ask at this point is, what is not 'normal' about being gay? Surely by virtue of the fact that it's so common (as you demonstrate though you litany of examples of highly visible gay representations) it's normal and natural?

-Tom F

Todd Hammond said...

Lol actually its people like you who are a miniscule cult part of the population and sadly not small enough. The good thing is my generation has learned from your mistakes, and your bigotted disgusting views on society will no longer just be out of date, but will be extinct.

- Todd Hammond (Monogamous, well behaved, tax paying and your eventual pension paying homosexual who has a fully loving and supporting non divorced family) Have a nice day.

robot girl. said...

As a woman who couldn't care less about being sexually attracted to men or women I'm not really into relationships at all, but you don't see me whinging about the fact that I 'can't get away from them'. Not everyone fits into the neat little sterilised box that you call 'normal'...

I think you need a dictionary or a reality check, (I can't decide which) when it comes to 'androgynous females' in video games. It's probably best that you don't bring up something you obviously know nothing about, as I'm a gamer and have NEVER seen an 'androgynous female' in a game. Varying degrees of over-sexualisation, no personality and lack of clothing, yes- but not 'androgynous'. You call yourself an 'accredited' English teacher? Don't make me laugh.

Cait Goss said...

What on earth do ancient Rome and Egypt have to do with anything? I'm going to take a wild shot in the dark here and guess that you haven't actually studied those civilisations and you're only going on what you've heard here and there. Why am I assuming this? Because homosexuality was encouraged in many ancient civilisations, ancient Greece and Rome being two of the most notable ones. If you knew that, it's pretty safe to say you wouldn't have thrown in the mention of ancient Rome as such an empty example just to make yourself sound wordly.

You are a nasty, bitter woman who needs to get in touch with the world you are living in today. You can either accept it, or keep your filthy, outdated, ill-informed opinions to yourself.

Unknown said...

I'm sorry you're upset by the weak and vulnerable standing up for themselves instead of letting you keep them submissive pariahs as in the past. I'm also sorry you wish our country to have more in common with countries in which it's unsafe to be an outspoken and independent woman... as you will find the rights and safety of homosexuals and women are strong and weak in the same places, should you actually educate yourself. I'm also sorry you see fit to belittle the community of people in cities instead of celebrating them.

mav_ian said...

Please, this satire is too unbelievable. As a country boy I'm offended at the bigoted and idiotic cliche I'm being presented with here. For shame, whoever wrote this. Nobody's this stupid in real life.

cat. said...

I hope this is sarcasm, no one can be this old fashioned/homophobic/stupid.

Cat said...

I'm bisexual and I don't think following cults is a very good idea... Most people don't, actually. The cult of Scientology, Jonestown, and of course the cult of Christianity. There have been some bad ones but that last one has really caused a lot of genocide, abuse and systemic societal problems.
But what I'm trying to get at is that being gay isn't a cult. I mean, it's pretty simple, you feel romantically attracted to certain people... from a young age, even having never been exposed to anything like that growing up, and for a long time not even knowing what to call it. How is that is any way relational to cults?
Also, I'm sorry I have to remind you, but you're talking about real people here. We're not figments of some far away land and we're not animals. I am a real person and believe it or not I have feelings, just like your daughter or you next-door neighbour. And I have to try to get through life and maintain some level of happiness doing that, with people like you who have never met constantly telling me they hate me. That's not something you ever had to deal with growing up is it? A number of my friends were kicked out of home when they were teenagers because they came out to their parents as gay. Others were excommunicated by families, who apparently loved them. Some of them ended up on the streets. Because of these family issues, bullying, and the constant ignorant insult from people like you, the rate of suicide for gay teens is many, many times higher than that of straight kids. That's what happens when your family and society alienates you.

I'm 21... for crying out loud... and I am a good person. I am a very good person - and I put more effort into ensuring that than the vast majority of people do - I don't deserve to be demonized by someone who's never met me. About my sex life, no less, which is none of your business to form an opinion on anyway. I shouldn't have had to deal with it in highschool and I shouldn't have to deal with it now, but I do. That is why people talk about gay rights, because we're sick of being treated like second-class citizens in the country we vote and pay taxes in.
Don't you think it might be worth doing a little bit of research and soul searching - and actually talking to gay people, before you open your mouth, when you have such a great capacity to hurt people who've never done anything to harm you?

I would like to invite you to visit my home town next time you're in Melbourne. I'll give you a tour of the nice areas, you can meet some good people, and have meal from my vegie garden. I can even organise free accommodation for you. You can contact me on save_the_envire@hotmail.com.

But, if the prospect of actually meeting gay people scares you, if the idea that we might actually just be normal, pleasant humans beings, is something that will shatter an important part of your world, then please don't talk the talk, because you certainly can't walk the walk, and you're hurting good people, okay?

Ilana Leeds said...

Well all the grubs coming out of the wood work, aren't they?
What is wrong with a man loving a man or a woman loving a woman??? Nothing really if it is kept on a spiritual or platonic level. I love a lot of people, but I do not have to make it a physical thing of intimacy because I know that is wrong. Physical intimacy is between a man and a woman within the bounds of a marriage union as far as I am concerned.
Wooo, Tehran we are into labels, aren't we? I am sorry but I do have a problem with that.
And Cat Goss I have studied both Rome, Greece and Eygpt. Did both Modern and Ancient History for my Senior and topped the year. (smirk)
Tom, what is normal about being 'gay' and not psychologically mature enough to have a long lasting and intimate relationship such as marriage with a member of the opposite sex? Oh, I get it, do you want to say that the rest of us, heterosexuals are abnormal and we should be more normal, just like the rest of the gay community?
Don't be too sure that my views are a small majority. Why hasn't the same sex marriage bill passed?? Are you going to say 'voter fraud???'
What you do, do in your bedroom behind closed doors. I do not want to know about it and I do not want my child or other children educated that it is a normal way to be. Call me what you want, but it is sick as far as I am concerned and call me bigoted all you like, but it is not normal.
Should we have compassion for gay people and try to help them overcome their psychological problems, yes. Should we not discriminate against them in the work place, yes. Should they be allowed to co habitat with each other yes, if they cannot control their urges. But to call those urges natural is to say that the priests who abused in the Catholic Church were only following natural urges too and I also disagree with that.
It seems that self control and modesty is out of style today.
If we all had more self control and less 'me first' nature then I guess there would be fewer wars, fewer babies aborted, fewer rapes, less child abuse and any number of things negative less in the world.
@ at Ian I really doubt you are a real country boy unless you are just trying to show how 'not country hick you are by taking on some good SNAG values in order to look good.
Yep, let's bring on the Redneck Radio Show. Any sponsors out there?? You can PM on Facebook.

ausryan said...

How many years until you are dead again? Less than 10? Good. Then I will be able to get married, with you watching from your fantasy that is heaven, and there's nothing your old outdated bogan (are)soul can do about it. And yes love, I did mean to spell it wrong, before you assume that all young people can't spell because we use text messages.

the heretic said...

please tell me you're a poe. please.

Ilana Leeds said...

@ cat
I am sure you are a good person and probably nice too, but just a very confused and muddled little girl. You needed to be accepted for who you are when you were very young. I actually think there are very few really homosexual people through chromosomes or DNA. I think there are a lot of pseudo gays who think they might be gays because of all the propaganda put out there by media and the gay rights movements.
Yes at Uni I hung out with both straight and gay people,(of both genders) had a couple of people tell me I was missing out by not experimenting with my own sex. Quite frankly it has never appealed to me. To be honest I had a warm and caring friendships with a few in our writing group for our mag.
I came to the conclusion that the gay community is very mixed up and I want to protect kids from the kind of muddled and dangerous thinking that the gay rights movements spout like Mount Vesuvius spouted lava. When kids go through a difficult teen time, they do not need to be told that they are gay. They need a warm loving family, a supportive family of them as a person. It is quite normal for a teen to hero worship a member of the same sex. What I do not like is for those kids who do hero worship to be taken advantage of and confused further. You are probably a really nice kid, just mixed up and looking for your niche in society and you got caught in the gay web. No hard feelings.

ManKitten said...

It's funny how bigoted people say 'no hard feelings' after spouting pure baseless hatred they know is going to upset people.

Simon666 said...

"Quite frankly it has never appealed to me." Illana, your impression of gay people or your imaginings of what our relationships mean are, frankly, less important than our own quest for equality. And as someone who is half jewish, I am as ever astounded to find come across homophobic jewish people displaying such devastating ignorance of the dark history that bigotry like yours directly reflects. You are welcome to your ignorant views, and entitled to them, but people like you should not be teaching in schools and infecting the minds of young people with your Nazi-like views.

Mark Le Gros said...

Just curious on your views in terms of relationships with people who are born with Intersex - ie: a physical abnormality where gender cannot be determined at birth, as I was born with, both male and female parts (although I am 46XY).

Which in my case, I neither see myself as nor female nor male.

cat. said...

I respect your right to be a Jew, but I don't want you to get all in my face about it you know?
I personally believe that what you are is wrong, and we need to stop praising your kind of people in the media. What you do behind closed doors is fine, but I don't think it is right that young impressionable children should be exposed to it.
I don't want my children to be groomed into becoming Jewish, but it seems these days it’s inevitable with schools teaching kids about ‘religious tolerance’ and that it’s somehow okay to choose to live that kind of lifestyle. And you can't deny that what you are is abnormal, otherwise why else isn't the entire population Jewish?
Now I really do believe that we shouldn't discriminate against Jews, and we should have compassion for them and try to help them overcome their psychological problems. And we should also not discriminate against them in the work place. But I reserve my right to publicly discriminate against your kind of people online, no matter how offensive it may be.

Now I’m sure you’re probably a nice person in real life, but a confused muddled old lady.
You were probably young and mixed up, looking for your niche in society when you got caught in the Jewish web. Why else would anyone choose that lifestyle?
No hard feelings, really.

Ilana Leeds said...

@ simon
which is half is Jewish? The left half, the right half, the bottom half or the top half?
@ Mark
No easy answers there and I would be debating with the one who created you as to your path. Sorry, I am only human as you are.
@ Cat LOL
I am glad you say you respect my right to be Jewish although I know you do not, by your tongue in cheek post. However you are confused as to what Judaism is. We do not educate any but our own children in our faith and fine, if any people do have problems with us believing in a G-D that created the world, it has been going on for centuries.
It is hard to be Jewish but ultimately very rewarding because the level of contentment that one attains with oneself and the development of one's spirituality is beyond compare. It is not for everyone and even many Jews find difficulty dealing with the demands of being a religious Jew or even a secular Jew. Yep, not for everyone, but look I can cope with a bit of old fashioned anti-semitism. So have another go and surely you will get tired of it eventually. Have a nice night.

Muttonlamb said...

Em, Surely this is a piece of satire? There's no way that anyone would actually say this stuff and mean it. If are actually serious, I would suggest that you switch off your TV, disconnect the internet and the telephone, don't look at newspapers and read only the work of Emily Bronte or Charles Dickens.

I'm desperately trying to finish this post without calling the writer names, but it's pretty fucking tempting!

Simon666 said...

I'm not sure which half of me is Jewish, Illana, ask your Zionist Nazi mates that one. And don't pull the anti-semitic card out; Cat's satirical substitution of Jewishness for homosexuality in her exact rendering of your OWN argument is obvious to all except your bigoted self. But since you're an unemployed volunteer advisor to a settlement built on Palestinian-owned land (Migron) that not even the Nethanyahu government sees as legal, you're hardly likely to have a worldview in which the equality of people plays any role. The important thing is that you should never, ever again be in a paid position teaching children, who need to be protected from people like you.

Simon666 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Jordan said...

Is this satire?
That was my first impression, however your further comments seemed to be serious.

Neale Duncan said...

This poor woman obviously has problems and we should all do a collective sigh and tilt of the head in sympathy. Hate the bigotry, love the bigot. (Hope you all got the irony there). There really is no point engaging with her and those like her. Whenever I come across people like her I smile because I know how difficult her life will be when we all have gay equality. Because equality is inevitable. And Ilana will sitting at home squirming and wretching, frustrated and disgusted, consumed by her own anger and hatred.........while we enjoy the rights and freedoms that are rightfully ours. And as a woman of faith, she will one day have to account for her bigotry. So we really shouldn't judge her. That pleasure is God's.

ezri-85 said...

I'm sorry, who are you again?

Damo said...

I think the best line is 'As she said, we can't get away from them and just have a normal TV experience, we have to have gay people in soaps, gay newsreaders, gay radio shows, gay politicians (quite frankly they are the worst), gay bars,gay events, gay movie stars and the rest.'

I don't want to burst her bubble, but, why can't politicians, actors and newsreaders be openly gay? And why can't a soap opera depict a realistic world, where gay people exist?

Sounds like Leeds is living in a fantasy land...

mav_ian said...

I am a country boy, I just came back from helping my parents milk the cows earlier today.
I'm not a "SNAG" trying to look good (if you saw my appearance you'd know vanity is not something I posess), nor am I particularly politically correct. I simply disagree, and having grown up in a conservative christian household I feel that living an extremely sheltered life is no excuse for spouting off ignorant opinions such as these.

I do think this "redneck pride" you seem to display is a little insulting, to people who live in the country. I am proud to have grown up on a farm, and around country people, and I object to this characterisation of being "rednecks and bogans." My family and I are more than that. Of course I'm offended in addition, but being offended doesn't really count for anything in my book.
And this assertation that "country life" is "slower" than all the "rushing around" of "city life" is counter to my experience: I've never known people who were less busy than my family and those around, since the farm is a 24/7 job and we have to travel further distances to places that are much more convenient in urban areas. A family with five children has a lot to get done.

Also this "redneck" radio station you want to start, you may have to reconsider hiring Alan Jones, since he's a homosexual (that's not a rumour, it's just not mentioned too often because it's not really relevant). So he'd be one of these "gay newsreaders" you would be complaining about.

(tobe continued)

mav_ian said...

(continued)

Now, I am assuming your opposition to homosexuality is based in Christianity; Now, you can refer to other passages in the Bible that refer to threatened rape of angels, lust that God gave those after they had displeased him, or prostitution, but the main source of these points is in two verses in Leviticus.
And the fact of the matter is, they were poorly translated in the King James Bible (possibly with an agenda), the key largely being the word "toevah" being translated simply to "abomination" where it has particular ritualistic connotations to do with preistly prostitution (a common occurance at the time). It has little to do with the modern concept of homosexuality. Here's one source:
http://ca.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100715182812AAexQzo
Here's another: http://www.lionking.org/~kovu/bible/section05.html

Many more sources can be found. And I can illustrate why the other biblical references traditionally used to villify homosexuality have been falsely characterised, but the information is out there, readily available.
I do expect a dismissal of this as coming from some sort conspiratorial "gay agenda" perhaps, and though facts should speak for themselves, the dearth in them in your polemic suggests you don't really care for them, nor increasing your scope of knowledge.

That's another thing: you talk about how we have an increasingly "vulgar" society, but use only rhetoric with no specific evidence cited.
I have seen many movies, but can't recall one that featured "naked women pawing at each other's bodies" that was rated PG. In fact, film ratings have become stricter in their censorship, particularly American films in regards to the MPAA because cinema chains have gained commercial foothold over the past 20-30 years and will only show films that pass these increasingly stricter codes, and Australia follows suit. ET The Extra Terrestrial was originally G here when it came out, but now is rated PG.
Source: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0083866/parentalguide#certification

And I'm not sure what videogames have "androgynous females" or what the impact they supposedly have.
In fact you state that Ancient Egypt and Ancient Rome had "modern times (sic)" though I'm not sure what point you were making. To compare them to "western civilisation" is a bit difficult, especially when Ancient Rome can be included as part of it. But if you start with the forming of Britain, then they both lasted longer than we've come so far by centuries, Eygpt by millenia.
And do you know what happened right before the downfall of the Roman Empire? It became Christian.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_rome#Fall_of_the_Roman_Empire

I think Christianity is very beautiful, but it has increasingly been corrupted, perverted and used to manipulate over the centuries, as it became institutionalised.

(TBC)

mav_ian said...

Overall, you seem to display a very confusing and immature view of sexuality in general. Decrying this apparent bombardment of gays in the media and the somehow shocking notion of teaching teens that "homosexuality is normal" (God forbid), seems to suggest that you could be easily swayed in what gender you're sexually attracted to by outside forces. Are you saying you could easily become "muddled up" as you put it? That the only reason you would find a man sexually attractive is that was what you were taught?
It was in my teens that I realised I didn't agree with the notion that it was wrong to be gay, and yet all the while I never found myself sexually attracted to the male form, and never once thought of myself as gay. After a while I found people who also felt no moral comunction with homosexuality, and the majority of us were, and remain, different sex-attracted, if you will.
"Hero worshipping (sic)" is not the same as being sexually attracted to someone, and I've never known anyone who decided to be gay because it was cool.

And your comparison of a sex act between two consenting adults and a priest molesting a child, reducing them both to "urges" is abhorrent, and utterly repulsive.

The reason I wrote all this is because I hate willful ignorance with a passion, and if I stand the chance to combat it, I'll take it.

mav_ian said...

Alright, I was mistaken regarding your religious affiliation, and I apologise for that. I am a bit embaressed that I didn't find out first. In this regard I'm out of my depth. My own assumption was based on my experience. My argument still stands, but obviously it is less applicable.
Though it also confuses me further. Now I understand a lot less why you feel the way you do, whether it's based on religion or upbringing. There was still a failure to communicate the "why" of all this.

But I stand by what I said in regards to your empty rhetoric and characterisation of country people.

Also, this blind belief in one political party over another, that being in labor automatically means a politician is corrupted and that all the liberal politicians are without scandal seems overly simplistic, childlike even.

Are you sure this isn't all one big joke?

James said...

You know Alan Jones is gay, right? We're not exactly proud to call him one of us, in fact you can keep him. The rest of your piece is just as well thought-out.

Brian walton said...

You can't be serious. Right? How many different people have told you what is happening here? Where did you get your degrees from, the back of a wheeties packet? If you are so highly educated then I am sure you would see what is blatantly in front of you. I am sick and tired of hearing this crap! how are you going to teach kids? That's really worrying as you will be teaching them how to be bigots. Have you been watching too much Andrew Bolt? How do you feel if I said that you are a stupid four eyed dumb as s@#t that needs to be not seen and not heard, in fact we will set up a camp for you with a uniform that has a lovely pink sheep on it, give some hard labour and send you to the showers (non water only gas). Get the big picture of your hate and your bigoted views. I worry for your own children and the kids you teach because if you were teaching my kids and I read or heard anything like this coming out of your mouth I would be asking for you to be removed from this position. Actually what school do you teach at? Remember what happened to Allan Jones's radio show!

Brian walton said...

Omg read the rest of her blogs omg omg omg she is just a hater omg omg omg!!!!!!!!!!

Ilana Leeds said...

It is kind of laughable and worrying reading all the comments here. Radio Reneck would be a foil for all the worrying stuff that spews out of the Gay Rights movement propaganda machine. It is interesting that my posts do not have 1% of the vitriol that some posters have churned out against me. Lots of assumptions. If Alan Jones is gay like you say then my respect for him. Has increased 150%. His sexual affiliations are his business and he does not need to shove it in our faces to be a fulfilled human being.
@mav_ian you are talking so much rot and making so many assumptions that I really do not have time to correct every erroneous point you make, except one, I have never stated that country people do not work hard. They do and so did I until I was forced out of work and had resulting health problems because of lack of work, stress and the financial impositions that resulted.
I love work and the fact that you blithely carry on about me not teaching just shows your ignorance. Unlike you I do not connect teaching English with my personal views on Gay marriage and to be honest I am not against gays, just the way they conduct themselves and the bullying. You are right that being part of a minority group is difficult but we live in a democracy and we all have the right to free speech so long as it does not advocate harm to others. I believe some gay people are harming the mentality and peace of mind of children and young teens.
People like mav_ian tend to project and jump the gun attributing all sorts of things and beliefs to a person because they have been so brain washed by the media of gay rights. Soon people will feel afraid to come out as heterosexual and we will have laws against men and women marrying. Hey, now that is a great science fiction story!

James said...

"If Alan Jones is gay..." You're not very familiar with your media heroes are you? Perhaps a little research on the circumstances of his departure from teaching at The King's School and his brush with the law in London is in order.

Mark Le Gros said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
the heretic said...

um.. you didn't actually address any of mav_ian's very valid points. he is saying that you have no reasonable basis, even in your own religion, for your views, but you are completely incapable of refuting this, in fact you didn't even try, saying you 'don't have time'. Isn't this your blog?

Mark Le Gros said...

Hmm okay, I was hoping for a more detailed answer than that.

For the record I have had relationships in the past with both men and women, while I remain gender neutral (except publicly just to make things easier for society in general, hence my gender obvious male name).

I think what I'm trying to demonstrate is that gender and sexuality isn't black and white but many shades of grey (I am trying to avoid borrowing a title from a certain book), and I'm living proof of someone who was born with both genders on a physical level - an abnormality from society's point of view, for me though I see myself as normal, just missing a few extra bits.

And there are others out there with similar Intersex conditions to mine, including people who are born male but their bodies do not recognise testosterone so they 'default' to female, although they do also have both gender's bits, including undescendent testes, which in fact is created from the same tissue that makes ovaries. That condition is called 'Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome', which comes in two types, partial and complete. The difference though is mine isn't genetic, just a 'biological accident' that cannot be explained. But hey, I'm unique.

So, because I am gender neutral from a birth defect, and have relationships with fully formed 'normal' (I use the word 'normal' loosely there as that is subjective) men and women equally, does that make me gay, straight, bi, in your books?

While I respect your beliefs as I hope you do with mine (which for the record I don't follow any religion, I used to but was rejected by that religion after I found out about my condition at 17 years old - they couldn't handle the idea that someone could be born with both genders), I think you need to do a bit more research into gender and sexuality before making sweeping statements. I've had to research it for my own realisation about my condition and through the support groups, Doctor's who deal with the area have explained to me how gender and sexuality really works, and it is actually quite complex, not cut and dry, nor black and white.

At the end of the day, despite my condition, I am human, as are all these people who have commented above, and from what I'm reading, they are having a genuine upset reaction to your beliefs. And I can see why.

**comment reposted due to typo**

Ilana Leeds said...

I would reply in detail to some accusations here if it were not for the fact that some of them are so hysterical and so misconstrued in their points as to be quite ridiculous. I will not give credence to them and dignify them with a reply except where and when I deem it necessary.
I am working on a post that will hopefully answer some questions but to be honest no one is going to bully me into accepting that a gay lifestyle is a 'normal' state of affairs. Even the majority of gay people know that. The vocal few who try to bully the rest of us into believing it is normal are seriously deluded. The healthy 'gay' person who accepts that he or she is different and understands that his or her lifestyle is not the norm, is an intelligent human being who has come to terms with his or her orientation. That does preclude them from being active and valued members of the broader community. However to try and foist the gay lifestyle onto the rest of us as normal is what I object too. The fact that I personally would find physical intimacy with a woman repulsive, is my personal feelings alone to own and I am allowed that. Just as I find child abuse disgusting and evil, murder horrendous, rape abhorrent and assault or battery absolutely terrible and unacceptable, I am allowed to feel that, although in the new politically correct gay nazi world of 2014 /1984 we are not allowed to voice anything that may offend a gay person. Look plenty of people say things I find offensive, but, hey I can and do deal with it. Freedom of speech. If you can go through the day without someone, a friend, family member, or aquaintance saying something that does unsettle or offend you, then you live in a glass bubble of unreality or people are afraid to say anything to you because they are afraid to offend you, they just think it and are not really your friends at all.

Simon666 said...

Don't try to turn the Nazi thing around Illana. You're the one putting yellow stars on people because they're "different". You're the one who thinks we need to be at the back of the bus. You're the one connected to these histories by your beliefs. You're entitled to these beliefs, but you need to understand where that places you in reference to those histories. You are not a fit and proper person to be teaching children.

Simon666 said...

My great grandfather died in a camp wearing a yellow star, alongside other "different" people wearing a pink triangle. Your "disgust" at the thought of gay people having sex is something you are allowed to have, think, and say, but your belief in different rights for different people has consequences, as we are now seeing in places like Uganda. We will outlive you and outlove you, so you just need to think more carefully about the consequences of your beliefs.

Ilana Leeds said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Ilana Leeds said...

I am sure you will outlive me Simon666, but as for out loving me, I am definitely sure you never will.. Your hatred oozes out like moulten lava. See, I never put anyone in a camp, nor would I want to hang anyone for being gay. I simply do not agree with a gay life style. End of story. Do I believe people should be punished for being gay, definitely not, but I do not thing the impressionable minds of teenagers should be warped by the gay communities political agenda. I am one of there's brave enough to stand up and say 'Enough! This gay rights thing has gone right over the top and it is getting ridiculous.' It is similar to people making something that looks and tastes like real meat pie but it is vegan. Now why would a genuine vegan want to eat something that looks like meat pie but isn't. If you want to be married, be a heterosexual and stop being so hetrophobic. That is I believe a mental condition.
:-)

Ilana Leeds said...

I love every human being in this world, despite not thrilled about some of the things that some humans do. We are all created for our particular purpose and mine is to serve G-D and to be a good person.
Love is a spiritual concept for me that has conditions on physical intimacy. We need boundaries to define ourselves and others appropriately, you Simon666 are unfortunately limited by your concept of love being a physical expression of lust, desires and wants that are all connected to your own ego. That is where and I differ, my friend. Peace and love. Have a great day.

Jason Noble said...

This lady was forced out of her job which she says caused her stress, financial & health problems. It has obviously caused her some mental problems in which she has become bitter and feels the need to lash out at other people. She has no affiliation with gay people and has no effect on her life, but she obviously takes pleasure in being nasty & taking out her bitterness with life out on this easy target group. She needs to concentrate on positive things in her life, learn to respect and love others and stop this sort of abuse of others, otherwise her negative mental state will continue to deteriorate in which she will end up a very bitter sad old lady.

Mark Le Gros said...

Mental condition? Mind if you provide solid evidence to support that claim?

In return, for my end, here's info on Intersex and related conditions, from the AISSGA (Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome Support Group Australia).

Mark Le Gros said...

Oops, forgot to post the link -
http://home.vicnet.net.au/~aissg/

Tamaska Geadh said...

Its hatred, ignorance, and lack of love that makes a person think, feel, and act like Leeds. As a health professional, I also get the distinct feeling she may have a psychologically condition that may require medication.

We must have compassion for this woman and have love for her, for without her 'shouting her vitriol from the rooftops', the average Joe stays complacent about HUMAN rights, and the right of everyone to find and experience love.

Regardless of the self-titled 'rednecks and bogans (to choose these titles for oneself plainly demonstrates the level of self-loathing one has), I will continue to shine my loving light, open my heart until every last one of them realises that they have nothing to fear.. We must lead by example..

ecoms_master said...

Waw... No followers on her blog yet... I wonder why? Brought up in a very stict Christian family myself, I was never thought to hate, discriminate nor reject anyone for their life style or choices. To the contrary, I thought that "following Jesus' foot steps closely" meant loving your neighbor, showing compassion and treating other as we would like to be treated. And yes, while there is a Bible, there is also something called "Free Will" and a God that is the ONLY one entitled to judge. He didn't put us here to do that. Common sence has proven that you catch more flies with honey than vinager. And something that just occured to me, I don't remember the last time I saw a gay person leading hate, discrimination and exclusion campaigns... hmmm. So much for being "straight" making you any holier than thou. Isn't it ironic that a gay guy has a clearer understanding of what it means to be a Christian than she does?

betty said...

Umm like go fuck yourself you evil mother fucking bigot

betty said...

by the way Alan Jones is GAY GAY GAY. People like you should have your kids taken away and forced to get sterilised

Ilana Leeds said...

So glad I don't have a Christian outlook especially as I am not a Christian but an Orthodox Jew. I am sure a gay male would have a much better handle on being a Christian seeing as I have NEVER followed the Christian religion or practised it as a religion. I have always believed in G-D.

@ Betty
Oooooooooooowwwwww baby, da luuuvvv that just reeks from your two posts, uunnnhuuhhh, you so sweet, go find yourself some gay bar to get your unrestrained frustrations at the world out.
Ooohhhh, I can see the hate WOOFFING OUT at me and I transform to it love and white light and hope you all continue your journeys in peace.
You know you are in the wrong and that a gay life style is harmful to you as a human being.
By the way Alan Jones gay or not is a good human being and you have no proof he is gay, just a smear campaign from the leftie media. By the way, the hypocrisy of the left gay media is breath taking. Maybe he has flaws and recognises them for what they are and tries to control them. There are human beings and being human heterosexual or homosexual, we are on a constant journey and strive for perfection. I find your arrogance irritating.
Go Betty, go, go. You and your Nazi gay mates have a lot in common. Whatcha gunna do darling?? Sterilise all the heterosexuals and choose a few females to harvest their eggs for gay men to have babies??
You are sick. Recognise it.

Ilana Leeds said...

What is amazing and worrying that people who purport to be health professionals make statements like this woman does.

Its hatred, ignorance, and lack of love that makes a person think, feel, and act like Leeds. As a health professional, I also get the distinct feeling she may have a psychologically condition that may require medication.

We must have compassion for this woman and have love for her, for without her 'shouting her vitriol from the rooftops', the average Joe stays complacent about HUMAN rights, and the right of everyone to find and experience love.

The sheer hypocrisy and malice of this woman is unbelievable. G-D help us all if she is really a health professional and G-D help any normal heterosexual who doesn't feel as if he or she wants to hang out with the gay crowd or support their values. I find that many people are nice people but some of them are spiteful and hypersensitive to an unbelievable degree and the fact that they have no control over their sexual impulses and urges (some of them) and will go after what they want despite the cost to society and their families as scary.
Nothing will stand in their way except that they get what they want which is totally against the true spirit of marriage.

James said...

So the lack of shame displayed by gay people offends you. You are troubled that they go about their lives as publicly as "normal" people and the media is complicit in accepting this behaviour. Are you similarly troubled by the observant Jews we see in the street with their distinctive hats and garments and their walking everywhere on a Saturday when all "normal" people are traveling by car? Should they pretend to be like everyone else? Should they be overcome by shame and not assert their right to live their lives as they see fit?

Ilana Leeds said...

James
It is not about expect gay people being ashamed of who they are. It is deeper than that. I am not ashamed to walk to shule on shabbes and yom tov. Why should i be? do I hurt anyone by walking to shule or observing my religion? Do I pronounce judgements of doom and gloom on people and say they should be in little apartments in Tehran or that I should be in a camp with pink sheep? I don't think so. I have talked simply about inner strength and restraint of unnatural desires. Is that so bad? Have I said gay people should be shot or imprisoned? No, but plenty of you have said worst about me. Have a loving and peaceful day.

James said...

Telling gay people to be ashamed is precisely what you are doing. You judge them as having "unnatural desires". I am not ashamed to hold my partner's hand in the street or to play sport with a gay sports club on a Saturday. Why should I be? Do I hurt anyone by living my life as a happy and fulfilled gay man?

You are upset by the hostility you provoke by telling some people they are less than normal because of they way they were made. Would you not be tempted to be angry in the same way at people who claimed that Jews were objectively abnormal and should not be tolerated in society?

Jane said...

Last I heard it was ok and not a crime to not be normal. In fact if being normal is being like this Leeds person and despising anyone and anything that is different then I relish in the fact that I am abnormal. Nature loves variety and diversity , its only small minded members of society that are afraid of it.

Lynette Petkov said...

I love it! You say
"Welcome to an eclatic blog of opinion, poems, short stories and waffles"...... and you're a teacher and you say you write and edit. It's Eclectic NOT eclatic, silly. Now that's embarrassing :)
Never mind all of the other rubbish you write you pompous woman. A little bit of empathy, a little bit of love and a little bit of humility and understanding. You still have time to open up your heart to others and become a better person.

Ilana Leeds said...

There is probably no point in continuing this discussion if you cannot see past the physicality of expression in intimacy. The greatest intimacy is in not being intimate.
The greatest intimacy is in being with a person and not being compelled or forced to give that love physical expression. This is where you lot and I part company because you are so filled with hatred and anguish sadly that you project all this poison onto me and tell me that I should be thinking and saying this about gay people or people who I are different. I do not. I value difference as I am different from the next person or the next and I do understand what it is to be an outsider, but will I get involved with another woman to satisfy that woman's lusts for me, because if I do not, I will be labelled anti gay or a bigot? NO, I definitely will not, because I know that it is wrong and even if I did by some weird chance have a desire for such an unnatural relationship, I would not give in to such physical desires. Do I eat on Yom Kippur? No, and that is a far more natural desire than being with a woman. Do I molest children? No. Do I go around slapping and punching people? NO. Do I go out into the streets and take my clothes off even if it is 50 C outside? NO. It is about restraint and self control.

Simon666 said...

"The greatest intimacy is in being with a person and not being compelled or forced to give that love physical expression."

Perhaps your greatest ignorance is in not understanding that that is exactly the same for heterosexual and homosexual people - love is love!

You look at us, and all you can think about is sex. This is where your problem lies.

When I see a heterosexual couple I do not think about them having sex. I do not think about penises going into vaginas. I think about love, commitment and support.

That is where your journey needs to begin, Illana.



James said...

I think you are probably wise to withdraw from this discussion as it is making you lash out with angry irrelevancies.

Living a good life is not a zero-sum game. Condemning others as "bad" people or parents because they don't act in accordance with your beliefs does not make you a better person or parent. A single-parent such as yourself can provide a supportive and loving environment just as a straight couple or a gay couple can, or in some cases may not. You should accept that and focus on the good you can do in your own life rather than tut-tutting with your postmistress about the decline of society and picking fights online. Take your kid to the park instead of exhausting yourself here.

Mark Le Gros said...

But the problem is Ilana, whatever sexuality you are, it's all completely natural, one cannot help it, just as one cannot help having blue eyes.

People cannot help their sexuality, whether bi, straight, gay. It is all completely normal, and in fact occurs beyond the human race as well in the animal kingdom. It's just nature which provides diversity, and with diversity, it should be respected and accepted that one cannot change or influence something that they have been given from day dot!

By the way, you are yet to provide evidence to suggest that being gay is a mental condition.

Also, you didn't come back at me about the Intersex issue, I'm really am curious about what you have to say about people like me who have NO PHYSICAL GENDER at birth - from what I've heard it happens in 1 in 5000 births.

I'll support the GLBTI community till the day I die, as I am a part of them, which I had no choice in from the beginning, as did everyone else in the GLBTI community. For me, I am both male and female at the same time (both physically and mentally and that has been the fact since birth - in fact Doctors forced me to grow up as 'female' for 17 years of my life despite my male DNA, but I'm dealing with it slowly.

I'd strongly suggest you do some reading into sexuality to at least become more aware of how it works as you are showing incredible ignorance and hiding behind a belief system (beliefs which are man made as far as I'm concerned personally).

If you want assistance with that I'm more than happy to direct you to some readings which are peer reviewed (some of it you'll find at least in relation to Intersex, on that link I posted earlier - please read it!).

Obviously your beliefs are strong and that I respect, but what I do not respect is your views on a community of real people who have struggled to accept their sexuality in a world where heterosexuality is almost revered to a number of people.

For me personally, I have struggled to have proper relationships with people with my Intersex condition which has caused me immense insecurity which has affected both me and my past partners (both male and female) and to say what you have said does not help it one bit. In fact you are making things worse for me from your words. It's not a lifestyle, it's what I have to live with day in day out, along with every other member of the GLBTI community! And I cannot change it, and in times past I have thought what if I could change it? I would love to be 'normal' as society sees fit, but I'm starting to realise that I am normal, as normal as the next person, I eat, drink, sleep, have the same emotions as everyone else etc.

One thing I'm learning from my psychologist is that if you can't accept other people for who they are and I mean that in the fullest including their sexuality (which they cannot help), then all you will do is push people away from you. People will not want to know you for who you are.

In a nutshell, Gender and Sexuality cannot be placed in boxes, it's all shades of grey.

Creating Passive Income said...

what makes this women so bitter and nasty....you can see it in her eyes and face...she looks like she's had a hard life with some pain and she wants to dish some back at other people. You can see in her responses she thrives on all this attention and being able to dish out some hate back at the world. Lady, why don't you put all your abundant free time to some good use and help some people through charity work or something instead of hurting other peoples feelings dishing out your nasty views of other people. Helping others would actually help yourself be a better person and improve yr negative mental state. You need to focus on your own problems ! Get some professional help if you need it seriously.

Muttonlamb said...

My favourite ever post by Ricky Gervais discusses atheism and contains some very valuable points on those of religious leanings using their beliefs to belittle others.

"Why don’t I believe in God? No, no no, why do YOU believe in God? Surely the burden of proof is on the believer. You started all this. If I came up to you and said, “Why don’t you believe I can fly?” You’d say, “Why would I?” I’d reply, “Because it’s a matter of faith.” If I then said, “Prove I can’t fly. Prove I can’t fly see, see, you can’t prove it can you?” You’d probably either walk away, call security or throw me out of the window and shout, ‘’F—ing fly then you lunatic.”

This, is of course a spirituality issue, religion is a different matter. As an atheist, I see nothing “wrong” in believing in a god. I don’t think there is a god, but belief in him does no harm. If it helps you in any way, then that’s fine with me. It’s when belief starts infringing on other people’s rights when it worries me. I would never deny your right to believe in a god. I would just rather you didn’t kill people who believe in a different god, say. Or stone someone to death because your rulebook says their sexuality is immoral. It’s strange that anyone who believes that an all-powerful all-knowing, omniscient power responsible for everything that happens, would also want to judge and punish people for what they are. From what I can gather, pretty much the worst type of person you can be is an atheist. The first four commandments hammer this point home. There is a god, I’m him, no one else is, you’re not as good and don’t forget it. (Don’t murder anyone, doesn’t get a mention till number 6.)"


http://blogs.wsj.com/speakeasy/2010/12/19/a-holiday-message-from-ricky-gervais-why-im-an-atheist/

Jane said...

Firstly - gay people are no more running around "acting out their lust" as you our it than heterosexual people are. Many gay people are in monogamous relationships and like heterosexuals lucky if they can even fit much sex into their busy mundane lives.

Second - its none of your business what kind or how much sex others wish to partake in yet you seem to think its ok to judge.

Third - You look like a really bad drag queen so it doesnt surprise me that you don't get any.

Jane said...

Firstly - gay people are no more running around "acting out their lust" as you our it than heterosexual people are. Many gay people are in monogamous relationships and like heterosexuals lucky if they can even fit much sex into their busy mundane lives.

Second - its none of your business what kind or how much sex others wish to partake in yet you seem to think its ok to judge.

Third - You look like a really bad drag queen so it doesnt surprise me that you don't get any.

betty said...

So hang on a sec let me get this right- You soew out a vile judgemental rant condemning and generalising an entire community of people then when people react to your bile you accuse them of being hateful and end the conversation. LIke hullo pot kettle black.

betty said...

So hang on a sec let me get this right- You soew out a vile judgemental rant condemning and generalising an entire community of people then when people react to your bile you accuse them of being hateful and end the conversation. LIke hullo pot kettle black.

Ilana Leeds said...

B"h
I thought the hatred and vitriol being expressed here had worn itself out. Apparently not. Better being spewed out at people like myself who can take it all with a grain of salt and feel immense pity for some or all of these posters.
The reading skills of many here is totally abysmal and I seek a lot of crackpots weaselling out of the woodwork. Comments that I look at people and see see sex have given me a real chuckle. I am celibate by choice and conviction since before the birth of my son. I know that worries people because for the world the way it is, sees sex, power, control, eating and drinking etc on the same level. I do not. To be honest I have far more important things and issues to deal with like getting work, supporting myself and a child etc.
The ones ranting are the people expressing their boundless outrage at what they perceive as my homophobia when I bear no hatred or malice toward homosexuals or whoever. Actually there is not one person in this world I hate. I dislike some of the things people do and I may for my own safety and the safety of others want people like Julian Knight and Martin Bryant safely behind bars because I believe they are a danger to the rest of us. They live out their impulses in a rather dangerous fashion, while there may be people who live out their impulses in harmless ways. I do consider a homosexual lifestyle as not normal and I will be honest. You should appreciate my honesty because a lot will think it but not say it for fear of the outrage and anger
that will be spewed at them.
I live a lifestyle which some people find different, but do I hurt others or set out to do so. NO, not at all. I don't ask you to live my life. I don't want programs put in schools to prove or pronounce "Judaism and an observant Jewish life' as the norm that everyone must live by and scream 'anti semitism' because some people find us strange. I do acknowledge that there are different people in the world.
There is a mature way of dealing with the world and life. I have had a gut full of this gay thing and even sex being pushed at us day in day out. So glad I do not have TV. The movies Sessions is another example of lowering the status quo of relationships to purely physical expression. I happened upon a flyer for this piece of smut and really the human race is degrading itself and becoming more stupid by the day.
Anyway peace and have a lovely weekend to some and gut Shabbes to my co-religionists.

Muttonlamb said...

"I've had a gut full of this gay thing". For someone that is suggesting that they are not hateful, your words betray you.

If you were to substitute the word gay in that sentence for words that describe you and your way of life, I think you would see that it is indeed hateful.

"I've had a gut full of this Jewish thing", "I've had a gut full of this women's rights thing", "I've had a gut full of this black thing", "I've had a gut full of this Muslim thing". All of those statement would, rightly, be viewed as hateful.

Wrapping up a message of hate under the guise of "loving rejection" is, in many ways, worse that just shouting faggot or dyke. At least with someone being directly abusive, they are being honest and true to themselves.

Whether you like, accept or even believe that some people are same sex attracted, does not change their core feelings. You can no more 'pray away the gay' that you can cause a spoon to turn into a fork through prayer.

It is you, Ilana, who is wrong in this matter. You opened up the conversation by abusing a vulnerable group of people. I'm thrilled to see that apart from your own responses, not one person has posted in support of your hateful views. That is progress and, in time, I hope your hate can subside to the point where you can just leave people to participate in loving, consensual relationships without throwing scorn and indignation at them.

Booligirl said...

Ilana,
Your "hatred and vitriol" hasn't "worn itself out" on this blog since 2008.
Yet you expect people who comment on your abhorrent mindset, which you willingly put on public display, to desist.
If you don't want to know what people think and feel about your ugly thoughts and options then keep them to yourself.

Jason Noble said...

Agree with Booligirl...everyone has the right to their own opinion, but when you make it public and come on you knew it was going to upset people, so why did you do it ? Because you enjoy upsetting others ? What people do in their own lives is non of your business. Live your own life and leave others alone and stop publishing hurtful comments. You are the minority thank goodness. If people like you didn't exist we'd all live in a much more peaceful loving world, without hatred and prejudice. Being gay wouldn't be an issue if wasn't for people like you.....and just remember it wasn't that long ago that women were second class citizens fighting for their rights & old men were making comments such as yours. If everyone was like you society would never progress...we'd all be back in the stone age, so come of age lady !

Ilana Leeds said...

@ creating passive income
I find your post with regard to doing charity work really amusing seeing as where possible I do do charity work and at least twelve schools have an open offer of my time to do reading recovery, literacy and numeracy work and have had for the past four or five years.
I do do work with old people and I am always available to help others. Doubt whether I could say the same for you. You sound very like a rather wretched woman I did know once, very sad individual unmarried and no child because of the slutty life she led, no guy wanted to a marry her because he would not be sure if his kids were his own or someone else's.
I don't focus on my problems because I am not so self centred. I do try to sort through my problems quietly by myself and not bother others.
You a sad. I do hope you find peace of mind. Sad sad lady ..have a good Shabbes.

Mary Hagan said...

What a sad person misinformed you are. Un-suprisingly I don't see a single soul saying anything in support of your very out dated nazi-esque view.




Ilana Leeds said...

B"H
Sadly Mary those of the silent majority are all too scared of the gay NAZIS who pour out of the woodwork to vilify and demonise anyone who seeks to differ or not support their perverse world and social views. Rand for example, would not support same sex marriage and neither does Julia Gillard. On that I respect her for her guts and integrity.

Mary Hagan said...

If you have to make a law that hurts a number of people, just to prove your morals or faith, then you have no morals or faith to speak of.

You are the one behaving like a nazi i.e. singling people out for being different to yourself and then judging them. I really don't understand how a jewish person can behave in such a way. The bullied really do become the bullies.

As for Julia, we all know how out of touch with the public the politicians are. But don't worry because pretty soon they will have no choice but to catch up with the rest of the world and with the 65% of aussies in favour of equality. Marriage equality is not a matter of if , its when. Then what will you do? Perhaps you could join the westboro baptists. They will have you dear.

Simon666 said...

First of all Illana, the term "silent majority" is getting a bit old - the people you refer to are neither 'silent' nor a 'majority'. Your post is full of vilification and demonisation. Try reading some of the "Völkische Beobachter" in the original German (Berlin, 1930s) in order to contextualise the arguments that you use, and to understand why you have a swastika branded in your soul. It's extraordinary that someone who advises an illegal israeli settlement has such a poor understanding of the historical context of the type of language that they use, and how it directly reflects the language used against their grandparents. You must the most uneducated jewish person I've ever come across.

Ilana Leeds said...

B'H
At Simon and Mary
The pair of you are laughable. Neither of you can come up with an argument against anything I have said so you attack me personally instead. Ad hominem attacks rather than argue your points across, you would rather say I am a Nazi, an uneducated ignoramus and any other derogatory comment you can throw at me in order to try and attack me psychologically and to unbalance me because you disagree.
Both of you are just out for your own little vilification agenda. Ok, you don't like my views that is obvious, but really to be honest, I was the person threatened with sterilization and to have my child taken away and also with a flat in Tehran and also to be put in a camp with pink sheep. Loved that one!!!
I have NEVER and NOR would I suggest that any person gay or not
be subjected to imprisonment,
sterilization, victimization or bullying because of their sexual orientation. Among consenting adults and do note I say consenting adults, their sexual behaviour is a matter of their own judgement and beliefs. What is right for me and my personal lifestyle choices dictated by my beliefs is my right to express and I am allowed an opinion, and it is not for others unless they are of a similar Orthodox persuasion and for some
there are even different versions of interpretation. My life is strictly controlled by what Hashem wants or what I believe Hashem wants of me. I disagree with homosexuality as a lifestyle and that is my right to do so. Marriage is for a man and a woman. I do not advocate burning gay people at the stake or hanging them or imprisoning them or even penalizing them in any way what so ever. However there are limits to everything. I, as a woman understand limits to what I can and cannot do within the confines of a Torah lifestyle that some may disagree with and say I have misinterpreted it and am not strict enough and others will say I am too strict. That is life.
I do not think you realise how offensive you are to the majority of heterosexual people who are otherwise not against gay or homosexual people. But we get it shoved in our faces again and again and again and again, so quite frankly, I for one and there are others am fed up. I should not be made to feel that I am not normal because I am a heterosexual who feels nothing physically for my own sex. Yes I realise some people are that way, but deal with the fact that I do not feel that way. I think it is weird and I think it is wrong. You can cry all you want about how gay people need to be married and blah blah blah, but to be honest, why do gay people want to be married. If they want to be married that much they would choose a heterosexual life style and marry a member of the opposite sex and grow up a bit. Yes there are people who are two gendered. I guess they think they can have their cake and eat it too. Being bi sexual allows a person not to commit to a relationship with either gender. To me that is a cop out. OOOOOHHH, I can hear some say 'this ignorant pig wants us to restrict ourselves to one person.' Well I have news for you. Most people do only want one partner for life and to have a family and to raise them as decent human beings.
You have vilified me for no really good reason and are trying to say I am the Nazi. I laugh madam and sir. You two are the joke. Attack the argument against gay marriage, not the person. You have shot yourselves in the feet. TTFN until next time I am bored enough to answer you.

betty said...

This is the most hilarious joke about right wing nutters I have ever heard. Good one Lllana the troll LMFAO

Sara Vontrapp said...

Wow I don't where to begin with this one! My first thoughts were that it was a joke. I'm not sure where this llana person is being forced to watch gay but last l heard the tv had an off switch and the movies at the cinema weren't compulsory. We do live in a diverse world and in a multicultural society and as such we do need to accept that those who are different to ourselves have as much right to be here and to express themselves including their sexuality as the next person. As a gay woman I can tell you I have had heterosexuality "shoved in my face" as llana likes to put it, since the year dot. Every magazine, every tv show, every movie. I go to the beach and I see young couples together, I go to the mall and I see young couples. It's everywhere. Homosexuality has been around as long as heterosexuality. Unfortunately though because of extreme religious views homosexuals were forced to live underground up until the 70s. That's all over now and at last gay people are as fee to express their love as everyone else.viiews like llana's are so outdated its laughable. She sounds like a bitter angry old woman afraid of change. Yes llana you have a right to think whatever ugly fearful thoughts you want however in a multicultural society if your views cause suffering or impinge on the rights of others then you have no right to have your voice heard. If this is what you want then you need to live somewhere like iran. It always makes me cringe to hear people like llana using such hateful language yet thinking its ok as long as she wraps it up in a facade of "love" or says it with a smile because its her "right"! They say things like "youre perverse, an aberration, sick in the head and should not be seen, heard or allowed to express yourself because it makes me feel uncomfortable, but have a lovely day bless you". Fortunately these types of people are a dying breed.